Introduction
Are you curious about what it takes to manage a list of 500 different wine labels at one of America’s best restaurants? Why is wine so powerful in creating memories? What is the most important role of the sommelier?
In this episode of the Unreserved Wine Talk podcast, I’m chatting with Sommelier of the Year, Tonya Pitts.
You can find the wines we discussed here.
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Highlights
- How did art play a major role in Tonya’s life growing up?
- Why is wine so powerful in creating memories?
- What motivated Tonya to switch from pursuing a career in law to becoming a sommelier?
- What was Tonya’s introduction to working in restaurants?
- Why is smell such a significant part of Tonya’s tasting process?
- What’s in Tonya’s mental wine Rolodex?
- What was it like to taste a 1900 Rothschild?
- How did a tasting of the 1976 Chateau Lafite compare to the 1900 Rothschild?
- What makes older wines so special?
- What does it take to manage a list of 500 different wine labels at one of America’s best restaurants?
- Why is it even more powerful to visit the place wine comes from?
- How did Italy win Tonya’s heart?
- What does Tonya love about the service aspect of being a sommelier?
Key Takeaways
- I found Tonya’s insights into what it takes to manage a list of 500 different wine labels at one of America’s best restaurants fascinating.
- She also shares some great behind-the-scenes observations on the role of the sommelier.
- My favourite part is when she talks lyrically about how she’s transitioned from the artist’s canvas to using a plate of food and wine to tell a story and paint a picture for someone.
- I also think she’s bang on when she says, “Wine takes you on a journey, you can go anywhere in the world, with a bottle of wine. The reason I still do what I do, and why it means so much to me, is that I can actually smell a glass, it transports me right back to that time and place when I originally had that bottle of wine. It’s amazing.”
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About Tonya Pitts
Tonya Pitts is the Sommelier and Wine Director at One Market Restaurant in San Francisco and she has been crowned 2022 Wine Enthusiast Wine Star Sommelier of the Year. Tonya has been a notable mogul within the wine industry for over 30 years. Outside of her Wine Enthusiast recognition, she was recently inducted into the Hall of Femmes (an award that requires being nominated by other women), awarded membership for Les Dames D’Escouffier, added to the advisory board of Women in Wine’s Leadership Symposium, and has become an integral contributor to Wine Unify.
Tonya’s career has involved a combination of consulting, judging and speaking as of late, mainly covering the evolution and history of wine. Yet, at the beginning of it all, she was one of few Black women in the wine industry, making the climb to her current status a solo journey. Tonya now makes mentoring a priority for those following in her footsteps, especially other minority groups that have experienced similar challenges.
Resources
- Connect with Tonya Pitts
- Diary of a Book Launch: An Insider Peek from Idea to Publication
- My Books:
- Unreserved Wine Talk | Episode 15: What to Ask the Sommelier with Lesley Brown, Canadian Association of Professional Sommeliers
- My new class The 5 Wine & Food Pairing Mistakes That Can Ruin Your Dinner And How To Fix Them Forever
Tag Me on Social
Tag me on social media if you enjoyed the episode:
- @nataliemaclean and @natdecants on Facebook
- @nataliemaclean on Twitter
- @nataliemacleanwine on Instagram
- @nataliemaclean on LinkedIn
- Email Me at [email protected]
Thirsty for more?
- Sign up for my free online wine video class where I’ll walk you through The 5 Wine & Food Pairing Mistakes That Can Ruin Your Dinner (and how to fix them forever!)
- You’ll find my books here, including Unquenchable: A Tipsy Quest for the World’s Best Bargain Wines and Red, White and Drunk All Over: A Wine-Soaked Journey from Grape to Glass.
- The new audio edition of Red, White and Drunk All Over: A Wine-Soaked Journey from Grape to Glass is now available on Amazon.ca, Amazon.com and other country-specific Amazon sites; iTunes.ca, iTunes.com and other country-specific iTunes sites; Audible.ca and Audible.com.
Transcript
Tonya Pitts (00:00):
I don’t paint with canvas and paints, which I have all of that still in my home now. I use the plate of food and wine to tell a story and paint a picture for someone.
Natalie MacLean (00:15):
That is your canvas. Lovely way to put it. What’s the intersection between wine and music, do you think? They pair together.
Tonya Pitts (00:23):
There are certain types of music that evoke a feeling and transport you. Wine is very much the same way. You can go anywhere in the world with a bottle of wine. The reason I still do what I do and why it means so much to me is that I can smell a glass and it transports me right back to that time and place when I originally had that bottle of. It’s amazing.
Natalie MacLean (01:05):
Do you have a thirst to learn about wine? Do you love stories about wonderfully obsessive people, hauntingly beautiful places and amusingly awkward social situations? Oh, that’s the blend here on the Unreserved Wine Talk podcast. I’m your host, Natalie MacLean, and each week I share with you unfiltered conversations with celebrities in the wine world, as well as confessions from my own tipsy journey as I write my third book on this subject. I’m so glad you’re here. Now pass me that bottle please and let’s get started.
Welcome to episode 226. Are you curious about what it takes to manage a list of 500 different wine labels and one of America’s best restaurants? Why is wine so powerful in creating memories and what is the most important rule of the sommelier? You’ll hear those tips and stories in my chat with Tonya Pitts, the wine director at One Market Restaurant in San Francisco, whom the Wine Enthusiast magazine recently named Sommelier of the Year.
Now, a quick update on my upcoming memoir Wine Witch on Fire: Rising from the Ashes of Divorce, Defamation, and Drinking Too Much. So after 10 years of writing and worrying and failing and living in shame and feeling silenced, I really didn’t think this would happen, but it did. The first printed copies of my memoir just arrived. This book is for anyone who’s ever felt that they lost their voice or lost their story, because I want to let you know that you can get it back again and you can find a strength you never thought you had. Sorry, I’m getting a little work worked up here. I wanted to share this moment of opening the first box with you, whether you’re one of the people who helped to get this book here today, or one of those who will take it farther out into the world than I ever could. Okay, so I’m going to open the box with my Champagne sabre. I never was traditional and I never do things the easy way. So I’m shaking, and that’s not good with a sabre, but here we go.
Oh, wow. Oh my gosh.It feels good. It smells good. Oh my Lord Looks great. I’ll put a picture in the show notes for you.
I mean, I think I’ve been including that all along. But it’s real, it’s a real book and I almost feel like Geppetto. Oh m,. I’m just looking at all the people who put their names behind this book and endorsed it. So if you feel you need a story about getting your voice back, finding a strength inside yourself that you didn’t know you had, if you want to support the message, this book’s message of hope and justice and resilience, you can pre-order the book now online from any bookstore, no matter where you live. You can also get copies for your friends. Talk about it over a glass of wine or two.
I did it, Mom. I let the words out.
Okay. Deep breath.
So here’s a review from Carol Miller, an early reader from Ottawa. “This book offers an authentic and honest voice of a woman who proves to be brave, fearless, funny, vulnerable, and strong as oak. If you’ve ever read her previous books, you’ll recognize the wit and honesty in which she conveys a subject. This book is intensely personal and brutally honest about important and relevant things like our relationships, our family, our friendships, our work, our reputation, as well as our weaknesses, struggles and losses, never preachy or prescriptive. Its power is the beautiful thing that happens when women and men open their hearts and share their stories”. Thank you, Carol.
Okay, got to get it together here. In the show notes at NatalieMacLean.com/226, I’ve posted a link where you can pre-order the book online now no matter where you are. This is also where you’ll find all of the juicy bonuses you’ll get when you pre-order the book. Okay, on with the show.
(06:46):
Tonya Pitts is the sommelier and wine director for One Market Restaurant in San Francisco ,Wine Enthusiast Magazine just named her Sommelier of the Year. She was also recently inducted into the Hall of Femmes, awarded membership in Les Dames d’Escouffier, added to the advisory board for the Women in Wine’s Leadership Symposium, and has become an integral contributor to the Hue Society, an organization focused on increasing representation of black, brown, indigenous, and people of coluor in the wine industry.
Tonya’s career also includes consulting, judging, wine competitions, and speaking. When she started her career 30 years ago, Tonya was one of the few black women in the wine industry. Now she makes mentoring a priority for those following in her footsteps, especially those from minority groups who face similar challenges. And she joins us from her mother’s home in San Francisco. Hello, Tonya. We’re so glad you’re here.
Tonya Pitts (07:46):
Good morning, Natalie. How are you today?
Natalie MacLean (07:49):
Great, thank you. Thank you. And so you’re with your mom. Just before we hit record, you said you’ve kind of been in a pod with her since the pandemic began.
Tonya Pitts (07:59):
Yes, I have. I don’t live that far away from her, just a couple blocks away, but it just made sense. I’m the oldest of six children and everyone either didn’t live in the Bay Area or they were just too busy and had work and sorts of things, so it just made sense.
Natalie MacLean (08:22):
You are the good and dutiful daughter. So you have another story related to your mom and the pronunciation of your first name. I’d love to hear that.
Tonya Pitts (08:33):
So my mom, basically I tell people when they ask how did you come to have a Russian name? And I tell people, well my mother saw Dr. Zhivago too many times when she was pregnant with me, which is why I wound up with a Russian name. It’s all Omar Sharif’s fault.
Natalie MacLean (08:54):
Well, that’s a dishy person to blame, so to speak. So it’s Tonya, not Tanya, right?
Tonya Pitts
Tonya.
Natalie MacLean
Tonya, I love that. Yes, absolutely. Tell us before we dive into your wine career a little bit more about your family. Were meals a big part of your childhood growing up?
Tonya Pitts (09:11):
Oh, gosh, yes. My siblings. It was funny. I would sometimes make dinner on Sundays. It would be my turn because – my Mom was a really good cook. – but I would sometimes make dinner on Sundays. And when I did, my siblings were so angry. They’re like, oh my God. Sometimes I would play classical or opera just for something different, right. There was KQED. PBS had a radio station in St. Louis where I grew up and so I would listen to a lot of the programming we would. And so on Sundays they would have really wonderful classical music and sometimes opera and so that’s what I would do sometimes on Sundays. Make dinner and have that on and listen to it as long as they would allow me to do that.
Natalie MacLean (10:05):
Exactly. Your siblings. Well, I’m surprised because most kids are teenagers wouldn’t tune into opera. What was it? Was it just the change of music or did opera appeal to you?
Tonya Pitts (10:16):
I loved and love all kinds and types of music, and I think especially during that phase and being a young person, so it was probably 14 or 15 during that time. Art had always been a really big part of my life. And studying art, even as a young person, that’s something that we would do on the weekends. There was an organization called Casa, and they had art programs for children and for adults. And so there was dance and music and art. And so I would go to an art class every Saturday, and I did that for a really very long time. It’s something that my Mom did for all of us as an enrichment, if there was something that we were interested in.
Natalie MacLean (11:09):
Was there a particular type of art? Was it painting that you were into?
Tonya Pitts (11:14):
So painting, pastels, drawing. I sometimes tell people I now don’t paint on a regular basis with canvas and paints, which I have all of that still in my home. Now I use a meal and a plate of food and wine to tell a story and paint a picture for someone. That’s exactly what I do now.
Natalie MacLean (11:41):
That is your canvas. Lovely way to put it.
Tonya Pitts
Yeah, it is.
Natalie MacLean
Oh my goodness. Yeah. And while we’re on this topic, what’s the intersection between wine, food, if you will, but especially wine and music? Do you think they pair together?
Tonya Pitts (11:57):
Oh wow. Well, I do think that there are certain types of music that evoke a feeling and that will take you and transport you. I think wine is very much the same way as well. Wine takes you on a journey. You can go anywhere in the world with a glass or a bottle of wine, and it’s really, really amazing. Even for me, I think the reason I still do what I do and why it means so much to me is that I can actually smell a glass, and especially if it’s something that I’ve experienced before and it transports me right back to that time and place when I originally had that bottle of wine. It’s amazing.
Natalie MacLean
It is.
Tonya Pitts
It really is. When you have a glass of wine and you have food and you have people around you, you’re creating these memories. And that is what wine does. It creates memories and it brings you right back to that time and place and that memory when you have that wine again. So it’s pretty powerful.
Natalie MacLean (13:14):
It is. It’s so evocative and the science has shown us that smell, especially even more so than taste, just connects directly to emotion and memory. So you’re really working with the best canvass of all, given that sensory power of wine to take you back to a certain place. So was wine a big part of family meals growing up?
Tonya Pitts (13:36):
Oh, gosh, no. My great-great-grandmother and great-grandmother actually only drank kosher wine. So Mogen David and Manischewitz would be in the refrigerator. And that’s what they’d have, and they’d have a glass of that every day. And that’s how wine showed up in my life that way.
But when I did start working in a restaurant and was old enough to drink, I would work in really nice restaurants and my grandparents would come in and have a meal. And because my grandfather had been in World War II and been in Europe, he understood what as sommelier was and what wine was. And so that was really very interesting for me. And I think even as time went on and I decided to go down this path, he understood and he knew what it was, which was really very important to me because I loved my grandparents, my grandfather, really, very, very much. He’s no longer living. It meant a lot because I had always thought that I was going to go to law school, actually was in a pre-law program and changed direction, decided to study art and move to San Francisco. And that’s how all of this kind of happened.
Natalie MacLean (15:08):
Wow. Okay. So you’re taking the art classes, that was your early inspiration for art, but what made you move to San Francisco to change paths?
Tonya Pitts (15:17):
Because I was spending too much time in the studio all my time. I was spending all my time in the studio, and I talked to the Dean of the art department, and he just said you know have studio art as a minor, but it’s really taken the front seat. And you really should think about not going to law school and not continuing on that path and doing this. I mean, because at that time I was thinking about going into the endowments and being a lawyer and working with galleries is what I was going to do.
Natalie MacLean (16:01):
So endowments are the funds that are fundraising for art galleries?
Tonya Pitts (16:06):
And yes, fundraising. So galleries are for museums, and there is a niche for that for lawyers was very small, very few women, again, in that role. And I just thought about it, would I really be happy? Did I really want to struggle with that? Because the numbers were so low and I just thought, you know what, no. And I went to San Francisco for a long weekend. It was in January. It was rainy, cold, overcast, and got off the plane and was standing, looking over the city on a friend of a friend’s terrace, and was just struck by the beauty. Even in the fog, I just thought oh my God this is it. And I took that weekend and I went all over the city and just explored. And by the end of those four days, I decided I was moving and applied to California College of Arts and Crafts.
And because I was not a resident of California, I had to wait a year. And so what did I do? I got a job in restaurants and the rest is history.
Natalie MacLean
Oh, wow.
Tonya Pitts
And that’s exactly how that went. But to backstory, I had worked in restaurants while I was in college in St. Louis going to St. Louis University. That first summer, the summer before I was going into freshman semester, I had always gone to the university on weekends. And so I had friends that were much older than myself, and they were all going to go work at this restaurant in the Central West End. And unbeknownst to me, the chef was a female and had lived at Provence for 10 years and had moved back to St. Louis to open a restaurant. And that was my introduction to restaurants.
Natalie MacLean (18:13):
And how did she influence your career? What did you learn from her?
Tonya Pitts (18:19):
And it wasn’t just her, it was everyone that were there because her friends came from all over the country to help her with that project. Some stayed after the summer, and that’s where everything just kind of blossomed and unfolded. Just having wine on the table at the end of the night and food, the conversations that were had about food and wine and the synergy was just really eye opening. It just really struck me. And even though I couldn’t drink, I could sit there and listen to the conversations. But one day, I got up enough nerve to pick up a glass, swirl it and smell and talk about what was in the glass. And that’s what did it. That’s exactly what did it.
Natalie MacLean (19:07):
And did they have family meals at that restaurant?
Tonya Pitts (19:09):
Oh yeah, at the end of the night.
Natalie MacLean (19:11):
At the end of the night. Okay, gotcha.
Tonya Pitts (19:13):
Yes, at the end of the night. But even still then, I had no idea that this is what I was going to do with my life. Even today, I can smell forever and that’s my process. I smell, write my notes, smell, write my notes, smell, write my notes, and then seven minutes later or so I’ll go into tasting and then write those notes. And it’s really because my process in learning when I was much younger, it was just that. I was just smelling because I couldn’t taste the wine because I was underage. Couldn’t drink.
Natalie MacLean (19:55):
Yes. So smell leads. And do you find separating those two, like smelling and then having this seven minute delay or whatever, how does that impact versus just smelling and then taking a taste like a lot of people do? How does that help you?
Tonya Pitts (20:13):
Well, because wine evolves and changes in the glass. And so you’re able to see several different layers of the wine and expressions because it’s all there. Whereas if you do kind of a quicker pass, you miss something.
Natalie MacLean (20:31):
Right. That’s true. And do you accommodate to certain aromas and flavours? So your first sniff might give you something, but then if you go back, you’ve maybe accommodated to the top layers, top notes, top aromas, but then you get something different as well. You’re changing and the wine’s changing.
Tonya Pitts (20:49):
Absolutely.
Natalie MacLean (20:50):
That’s a great technique. I’m going to try that. Thank you. You were working in the St. Louis restaurant, then you decided to move to San Francisco for art school. So which restaurant did you start working at in San Francisco when you got there?
Tonya Pitts (21:05):
Zuni Cafe.
Natalie MacLean
Oh, the famous
Tonya Pitts
Was my first job in the city. And I tell you, I just really think that it was the fates. I think it’s was supposed to happen. Sylvie Darr, who was the wine director at that time at Zuni, she talked to me for about an hour and a half and told me to come back the next day and told me what to wear, what to do, and that was the beginning of that. And I started as a server there, but I think so we realized that I was interested in wine and more interested than most. So whenever there was a tasting, she would always allow me to taste wine. She was very supportive and kind of coaxing me out of that shell.
And once I just kind of dived in, I just kind of fell in headfirst even more so, especially being in a city as cosmopolitan as San Francisco. And just being opened up to more wines of the world and Old World, which I’d already had quite a few of the Old Wines that my palate was much more geared towards Old World anyway, because of the first restaurant that I’d moved in.
Natalie MacLean (22:36):
So that first restaurant must have had a wide French list, dd it?
Tonya Pitts (22:40):
Oh, French, Italian, and Australian, and some domestic wines some California wines as well. But they were the classics. The classics all the way around. Once I had my first Lafite.
Natalie MacLean (22:56):
Oh, your first Lafite. That’s quite a sentence. Which one was that? Do you remember the vintage?
Tonya Pitts (23:03):
Oh gosh, it was 1976.
Natalie MacLean (23:05):
Oh my goodness.
Tonya Pitts (23:06):
Vintage. And yeah, the list was crazy. And now that I think about it. That now that I’m older and think about it, it’s like wow. And I had no idea.
Natalie MacLean (23:18):
Yeah, top growth Bordeaux. My goodness.
Tonya Pitts (23:22):
And even as time passed by and I would taste through vintages, that is still one of my favorites.
Natalie MacLean (23:30):
You benchmark? You remember still? You have that in your library of aromas and taste?
Tonya Pitts (23:36):
I call it the Rolodex.
Natalie MacLean (23:38):
Oh really? Tell us more about that. You have a wine Rolodex in your mind?
Tonya Pitts (23:43):
Oh yeah. In my head.
Natalie MacLean
In your head?
Tonya Pitts
If I’m having a moment of recall, I have even been known to kind of do this. I’m flipping. I’m turning. Because it is a visual. Think about it, and it kind of coaxes you and brings you right front and centre to that note, to that place, to the wine, so to speak.
Natalie MacLean (24:09):
And for anybody who’s part of Gen Z and might not be familiar with Rolodexes, it used to be the way we stored business cards, youngsters. And it would be on a big wheel, and you would flip literally to the person you wanted to contact. But you’ve got this wonderful mental model for your flipping in your mind to the different aromas of different wines you’ve stored away. So that’s lovely, lovely image. And you also in that Rolodex, for your birthday someone opened a very special, very old. I think it was Bordeaux. I think it was 1900.
Tonya Pitts (24:43):
Oh, yes. The Rothschilds. It was a 1900
Natalie MacLean (24:48):
A 1900. Holy smokes.
Tonya Pitts (24:50):
The oldest wine that I’ve ever tasted. And it was really, really exciting because the cork was just basically just kind of disintegrating. And we had to sift out the cork, but the wine just kept going and expanding it was just really lovely.
Natalie MacLean (25:15):
It wasn’t dead? It wasn’t oxidized? Wow.
Tonya Pitts (25:19):
Oh my gosh.
Natalie MacLean (25:19):
That’s incredible.
Tonya Pitts (25:21):
I’m going to have to get that out, because we actually videotaped the whole process and that part of the evening, and when we would go back to taste, we videotaped that. So I actually have it saved. Someone put it on a CD Rom and gave it to me. So I need to look at that.
Natalie MacLean (25:44):
That would be wonderful. And to share. Yeah.
Tonya Pitts (25:46):
Oh my God.
Natalie MacLean (25:47):
Oh my gosh. What did it remind you of? How would you describe it today? I mean, it was still alive, still fresh, but if you were to write a tasting note about it, how would you describe it?
Tonya Pitts (25:57):
It was is though, and this is how I remember it and recall, it’s that warren piece of leather that would be a book, a journal that you’ve had for many, many years. And you open it and the smells that would come out, the kind of leather and almost this kind of organic and inorganic smells that would come through. Earth and dust and dried fruits, plums, cassis, raspberry, chocolate. But then it’s that flower that you’ve had. Rose petals that are dried that are there as well. And that came through. It was really, really fascinating and really beautiful.
Natalie MacLean (26:59):
I love that image, too, of the book. The worn leather and maybe even the pressed rose petals are in between the pages. I just love that unfolding of that wine. Beautiful. And how would you compare that maybe to the ’76 Lafite if you were trying to contrast them?
Tonya Pitts (27:15):
That was fresher, brighter, almost kind of jumping out of the glass. I almost see that as a parade. And I don’t know if it’s because it’s 76, right. The 4th of July, 1976.
Natalie MacLean (27:35):
Right, the centennial.
Tonya Pitts (27:36):
Yeah, but just more kind of youthful, plum, red apple skin, bittersweet chocolate, chicory. Ntes like that.
Natalie MacLean (27:51):
Yeah. Fantastic.
Tonya Pitts (27:52):
Yeah. Really, really beautiful as well. I love Bordeaux.
Natalie MacLean (27:56):
It is classic.
Tonya Pitts (27:57):
I think that’s because those were some of the first wines that I experienced as a young person.
Natalie MacLean (28:05):
You cut your teeth as a baby sommelier on Bordeaux.
Tonya Pitts (28:09):
Yes, completely.
Natalie MacLean
Fantastic.
Tonya Pitts
But I also love older wines in general, and even from anywhere in the world, from Washington, California. I like aged wines because I really think that they tell a story as though you’re experiencing history in a glass bottle. And whether you were there or not, it gives you kind of a glimpse into that moment and into that time.
Natalie MacLean (28:41):
Sure. It does. And the aromas are interesting, too. They’ve evolved. It’s kind of like people that they are having a more interesting conversation with someone or something or some wine that brings more to the glass, that it’s not the obvious upfront fruit. It’s those, as you say, the leather and the pressed rose petals, that sort of thing. It’s really subtle.
Tonya Pitts (29:03):
It’s a much more in depth conversation.
Natalie MacLean (29:05):
It is, yes. Have you ever dropped a bottle of wine accidentally, of course?
Tonya Pitts (29:14):
I have. And thankfully it’s not been on the floor during service. I’ve dropped a bottle or two in the cellar. May it be the showcase cellar where all the windows are, but that’s been before or after hours or in the larger back cellar. That’s happened before, too.
Natalie MacLean (29:39):
Do you remember what bottle or what was it?
Tonya Pitts (29:43):
They have not been bottles that are super expensive, let’s just say that. Thank God. Cause they’ve been more kind of by the glass sort of things. Or if I didn’t use the ladder and I was trying to stand on a box or on my tippy toes and carry too much and drop something. The other thing when that happens and the bottle just bounces, that’s the best. It doesn’t break.
Natalie MacLean (30:10):
I didn’t know bottles could bounce, but yay.
Tonya Pitts (30:14):
They can.
Natalie MacLean (30:14):
Mine don’t. Nor do my wine glasses. They’re just, ah. Anyway. But yeah, it must get. I mean it’s very physical what you do as well. Getting all these bottles from different heights. And then there’s inventory taking where you’re probably moving around a lot of stock. I mean, it’s a physical job, too, being a sommelier, isn’t it?
Tonya Pitts (30:35):
Yes, very much. And then moving boxes, which happens before and after service because you’re getting your days started and set up. And then at the end of the night, you’re setting up for the next day’s service. I’ve been very, especially within this role at One Market, since it’s such a large restaurant. I’ve always had people on staff and mentored who want to learn about wine, who want to come in the cellar, and who want to help. And so that’s always been pretty fantastic. Something I used to do sometimes at the end of the night, if it were a weekend night, I’d have people come in and help in the cellar. And we’d turn music on and I’d open a bottle or two of wine and we would put the wine away and listen to music, taste the wine, talk about wine, and it made it a lot more fun. But you get people’s attention that way. And the retention as well. That was always really good. And I would do that for staff, too.
Natalie MacLean (31:47):
Yeah, that is a great way obviousl, to learn about wine. There is a huge difference between reading about Burgundy or wherever Bordeaux from a book and then actually tasting it. You’re evoking that sense memory again as you taste, and even better. So I think if you can taste while you’re in the region, it’s just so many layers of learning. If you can do it that way.
Tonya Pitts (32:09):
That is just an eye-opening experience to actually go to the place and have the wine, because then that brings us back to that memory because it ties everything together. And if you can be in that place, see the people, taste the food, walk through a vineyard, touch the soil, it’s like wrapping everything up and putting it in a bow like a gift.
Natalie MacLean
Yes. Right.
Tonya Pitts
Yes. It’s a present, absolutely. But it’s an absolutely splendid present because you can come back to that time and time again. Yeah. And we live that moment.
Natalie MacLean (32:50):
Yeah, it’s true. It’s a present to your future self. I love that gift that keeps on giving the memory. And do you have a favorite region that you’ve visited that really comes back to you a lot? I’m sure you’ve visited lots of regions?
Tonya Pitts (33:03):
They all are. I think the one that I come back to time and time again. There’s several: my first trip to Portugal, which just the sight sounds, smells because it was during the fall and just it was absolutely splendid because of also the history as well, the architecture, the buildings and the wine and the people and the food. And then also as I’ve gotten older, I realized that my heart is in Italy.
Natalie MacLean (33:41):
Oh, really. Why is that?
Tonya Pitts (33:42):
Well, the first time I went to Piedmont and actually went to Lamara, and I was standing in the vineyard and looking at
Natalie MacLean (33:58):
Famous winemaker, yes
Tonya Pitts (34:00):
The sky. And it’s as though you can touch the heavens. And lamara, it’s like right there. And so to me, that’s what the wines are like. They’re heavenly. They’re terrestrial. And so that’s my memory whenever I’m thinking of that region or tasting wines from the region. And it really does lift and heighten because I’ve been there, because I’ve been to the region and spent a little bit time there.
Natalie MacLean (34:31):
And you have an artist’s way of remembering it and talking about it. So you bring that extra layer to those memories. Just wonderful. And the other wine regions stand out for you in terms of a memory that comes back?
Tonya Pitts (34:45):
Of course, France, because that’s where I cut my teeth.
Natalie MacLean (34:50):
Was there a particular vineyard there that you remember like the Italian?
Tonya Pitts (34:54):
Well, basically Provence. When the Mistral, just the breeze and touching your face and the wind and the warmth and the heat and the smell and the rocks. I love rocks.
Natalie MacLean (35:12):
Excellent. Another rock nerd, yes. Do you like smelling rocks? You can admit it if you do.
Tonya Pitts (35:19):
Oh yes, I do.
Natalie MacLean (35:19):
Picking them up and spelling them
Tonya Pitts
I do. Oh my gosh.
Natalie MacLean
I’ve been tempted to lick a few rocks, but then I thought, that’s probably not safe.
Tonya Pitts (35:27):
You probably shouldn’t do that. But you know, have to gather the essence of that material because wet rock and dry rock smell completely different. There’s a sensory smell that I have, and it’s fresh, wet soil during the rain, in the middle of the rain and after the rain, and it all smells different. And there’s fresh soil that is just beginning to dampen that has a certain smell. When it’s soaked, it has a different smell. And so that is a sensory smell that I do have. And there are some times that you do get that in some red wines, that particular earth component.
Natalie MacLean (36:18):
Yeah, absolutely.
Tonya Pitts (36:20):
And when I smell it, I actually visualize it and I see it.
Natalie MacLean (36:24):
Would you describe a wine to a customer like that? I guess I know it would depend on how much knowledge the customer had, but are those kind of terms you would use when you’re presenting a wine?
Tonya Pitts (36:34):
Sometimes, if it makes sense. But as I’ve said many times, you have to meet people where they are. And you don’t want to talk over someone’s head or beyond their knowledge. It all has to make sense, and it has to be appealing and pleasurable for people. When I take a chance on something, and if I don’t have exactly what someone’s looking for, I will talk about something that is similar or what I think is a transferable variety or a bottle. But I’ll say, if you don’t like it, I’ll take it away and bring something else. And for me, when you open that bottle and the guests tastes it and the light bulb and this the sparkle in the eyes, and that’s just because you did it. And you turned someone onto something new, different, and exciting. And now they want to go out and discover more.
Natalie MacLean (37:40):
Yeah. That’s true. That’s magical. It’s like students learning. My Mom was a school teacher for more than 30 years, and she just loved that moment. As you say, the light bulb goes on and their face lights up and they understand, and their world has been opened up another inch or two. It’s pretty, I’m sure, gratifying for you.
Tonya Pitts (37:59):
Yeah. GThat’s one of the reasons that I’m probably still on the floor as well is the interaction with guests and talking about wine. And most definitely the service aspect. I’ve done this for many decades, more than two and it’s been really gratifying, really gratifying. It’s been a fun and lovely ride. It really, really has been.
I tell people that I didn’t choose wine, wine chose me. Because I didn’t know that this was something that I could do or even that was available to me. I didn’t see a lot of women. I didn’t see a lot of people of color. I saw and really no people of colour when I was coming up the industry and doing this. And now here I am, and it’s important to me to give people encouragement and to be supportive when they have an interest in this.
And it’s all people. If I have someone that’s a lawyer, an executive, or whatever and they say gosh I would love to have your job. I’ve been studying. I love wine. I have a collection, but when I retire or stop doing this, I would like to kind of dive in and do this. And I say to them, if it’s something that you’re really serious about and you have love and a passion for it, absolutely, I’d be happy to speak with you. And I’ve had some people take me up on that, that have changed careers or finished a career and decided to go into wine. And so it’s possible. It’s possible. Anything is possible, but you have to nurture people.
Natalie MacLean (39:52):
Yes. Well, there you have it. I hope you enjoyed my chat with Tonya. Here are my takeaways. Number one, I found Tonya’s insights into what it takes to manage a list of 500 different wine labels at one of the best restaurants absolutely fascinating. She also shares some great behind the scenes observations on the role of the sommelier. My favorite part though is when she talks lyrically about how she’s transitioned from the artists’ canvas to using a plate of food and a glass of wine to tell a story and paint a picture for someone. I also think she’s bang on when she says wine takes you on a journey. You can go anywhere in the world with a bottle of wine. It’s the reason I still do what I do and why it means so much to me is that I can actually smell a glass and it transports me right back to that time and place when I originally had that bottle of wine. It’s amazing. Amen, Tonya.
In the show notes, you’ll find a full transcript of my conversation with Tonya, links to her website in restaurant, the video versions of these conversations on Facebook and YouTube live, and where you can pre-order my memoir online now, no matter where you are, that’s all in the show notes at NatalieMacLean.com/226. Email me if you have a sip tip or question at [email protected]
If you missed episode 15, go back and take a listen. I chat about what to ask the sommelier with Leslie Brown, who is with the Canadian Association of Professional Sommeliers. I’ll share a short clip with you now to whet your appetite.
Leslie Brown (41:47):
This point, it always comes to the top of my five most embarrassing stories. And I was with a colleague and we were fortunate enough to visit Graham’s Port house at the time. And the owner himself, Rupert Simington, was showing us around, and we had stepped into the old lagars where they hand stomped the grapes back in the day in order to extract the colour and make an optimum port. And in these cement lagars, which are big troughs, they had these windows. So my colleague and I thought it would be really fun to take photos of each other through these little holes in the wall until Rupert Simington informed us. That’s where the men would pee during their breaks on the stomping. So that quickly ended our giggling and fun, and we took things a little more serious.
Natalie MacLean (42:34):
I guess they were well framed, too, those photos.
Leslie Brown (42:36):
Two embarrassing stories right off the bat.
Natalie MacLean (42:38):
Excellent. You are one of us, Leslie.
Natalie MacLean (42:46):
If you like this episode, please email or tell one friend about it this week, especially someone who’d be interested in the wines tips and stories we shared you won’t want to miss next week when we continue our chat with Tonya Pitts. Thank you for taking the time to join me here. I hope something great is in your glass this week, perhaps a wine with a great backstory.
You don’t want to miss one juicy episode of this podcast, especially the secret full body bonus episodes that I don’t announce on social media. So subscribe for free now at natalie mcclean.com/subscribe. Meet me here next week. Cheers.
